I only got into rugby coaching when my eldest was in the U11s and his head coach appealed for help. Standing on the touchline and watching, I figured “ah – he means me…”. Initially, I just put out cones, held tackle bags and blew a whistle (lots!) [Ed: the Karl is strong in this one.]
A few years on, I’m part of a group of four coaching 30-40 U14s that combines the two age groups of U13 and U14.
Kerry is very much GAA – especially Gaelic football – country. But rugby has a history here, and actually pre-dates the GAA. The 1880s to 1920s were a time of huge turbulence in Ireland, and part of that led to the abandonment of rugby as a ‘foreign sport’ in favour of the new ‘Irish’ game (soccer, cricket and hockey were also regarded as ‘foreign’). Historically, a football game called ‘caíd’ was played in Kerry, but there’s very little evidence of how it was played: we can surmise it might be closer to the Shrove Tuesday games played in England than any modern code of football. There are theories that it might have been akin to Aussie Rules, as that seemed to spring up on the gold fields in the 1850s, where many Irish had headed off to make their fortune.
Rugby in Killarney goes back to the 1880s, and the club notes an official founding of 1929 – but it’s been re-founded on at least 3 other occasions: 1937, 1953 and 1983. With our own field and two decent pitches (and a third … well, it needs work…), we’re in a position to grow rather than just survive. In September 2019, we even hosted a Munster pre-season training session.
As a club at U14 level, which is the first competitive level (full-sized pitch, fifteen a side – hopefully), we compete in what is termed West Munster – essentially this is the other clubs in Kerry plus one other. We only get to play clubs from Cork and Limerick in friendlies or challenges slotted in between regular fixtures. In an ideal world we’d break out of this, as we end up playing the same local rivals three or four times in a season. In September, it’s all healthy competition; by March they hate each other’s guts. Doesn’t help that same group of lads also run into each in schools and club football and soccer over the same period.
Our season breaks into two parts. Before Christmas, there is a local league decided by a premiership-style knockout format (1 v 4 and 2 v 3) to eliminate the vagaries of no home-and-away. After Christmas, the West Munster teams split into an upper and lower section, with a home and away format. We took this opportunity to split our squad in two. The competition rules initially were that you could name an extended panel, and play all the subs in a non-competitive ‘3rd half’.
However, several clubs were struggling to make fifteen, so the rules reverted to two halves and a maximum squad of 23. That left us with ten not getting any game at all, plus subs only playing five to ten minutes at the end. The three-thirds is well-intentioned, but it’s really aimed at clubs with maybe 23-25 players to ensure everyone plays. It’s well-nigh impossible to play 15+ subs: you end up trying to replace the whole team without giving them adequate time to ‘gel’ as a unit.
We bit the bullet, knowing that we’d be stretched for numbers at times, but also knowing that we had the option to start with as few as twelve if numbers got sticky. The real restriction was having to separate the two squads: that meant a few hard decisions.
We wanted a ‘Black’ team to have a chance at winning their competition, but we didn’t want a ‘Red’ team comprised only of inexperienced – and in many cases smaller – 12-13 year olds who’d have to face up to teams made up mainly from the age grade above. A couple of the older lads were asked to step down to the junior squad to help provide some experience and sheer size.
The smaller size of clubs down here means that we don’t have a dedicated U13 competition, which means our younger players can be faced with bigger and more experienced U14s at a time when they’re really just learning to play the ‘adult’ game. It was a risk, but the alternative was standing on the sideline getting cold or not playing at all.
In our first Black game, we lost away to what was regarded as the best U14 in our region, but the seeds were there. 38-14 was final score, but we were beginning to see our strengths (and weaknesses) and to start to recognise the opposition’s.
Strengths: good scrum (if not a lot of use at U14 as limited pushing is allowed), strong, fast ball-carriers, good kicking game.
Weaknesses: looking for contact, over-carrying, weak support running.
Red started off badly, run ragged by a combined club with a couple of gifted individuals. Their second match, a return fixture, was much the same until we persuaded the opposition to ‘retire’ their No.8. Thereafter it was much more even, and you could see the inexperienced players beginning to develop their teamwork and understanding: where should I be? who’s my man? Attack the ruck or stay out?
Their remaining two games were close – a one-score difference in each game – and unlucky not to win one or both of them. But overall, despite the disappointment of losing, they all got to play an hour’s rugby in four games, and there’s a development in actually playing that you can’t get from all the training sessions in the world.
Meanwhile, in Black world we had 2 good wins: 26-17 and 28-7, the first win from 12-0 down and for much of the game playing 13 v 15 when the opposition conveniently ‘forgot’ that all clubs had agreed to match numbers. There’s a bit of thrill when you comprehensively defeat a team whose mentors are trying to pull a fast one. The second win was against a club we’d lost to twice earlier in the first half of the season by 5 and 3 points – basically losing both games from a place where we should have won.
In both wins, there was a pleasing degree of – dare I say it – ‘T-CUP’. Carrying the ball against the wind, and in the second half kicking long and chasing like demons. Then came a defeat: 12-5 and a wake-up call that we’re weren’t going to bulldoze everyone. Our final – not that we knew that at the time – game was a return versus the Tralee team who’d handed out two thorough beatings to us before. Tables were turned this time as we defeated them 36-5.
So it looks like we went out on a high. The lads themselves were recognising their strengths and trying not to play to those of the opposition. We helped them by moving our usual 8 (quick, strong but not excessively big) into 10 and letting him get into the face of the opposition 10 … who didn’t get the armchair ride he was used to.
For me, the main takeaway or ‘learning’ (as my international work colleagues might say) is that we need to get lads playing. We can train them with drills to develop the skills, but they need to play, and play together, to build up their knowledge. Five, ten or fifteen minutes as a sub doesn’t help that development. It’s certainly a bugbear of mine to see a visiting club arrive with 23 or 24 players, knowing that numbers 16-23 will get a few token minutes when the game is already won or lost. We’d be better off to play 12 v 12, and adjust the rules slightly.
I get irritated by coaches for whom winning is obviously the priority. Winning is great, but the long-term view is to have as many as possible playing – and enjoying playing – our game. Hopefully, some of them will be standing on a touchline in 30 years’ time, having replaced me….
Courtesy of Triskaidekaphobia.
Ovally Balls 
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/apr/14/man-accidentally-ejects-himself-from-fighter-jet-during-surprise-flight
On reading the article it turns out not to have been a Karl.
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Premature Karl
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Not a good look Tomp.
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Best coaches ever according to the lads from the Sunday Times:
Stuart Barnes
1. Carwyn James (Llanelli, Lions)
2. Steve Hansen (All Blacks)
3. Clive Woodward (England, Lions)
4. Rassie Erasmus (Springboks)
5. Warren Gatland (Wales, Lions)
6. Jack Rowell (England)
7. Ian McGeechan (Scotland, Lions)
8. Joe Schmidt (Ireland, Leinster)
9. Mark McCall (Saracens, England)
10. Eddie Jones (Brumbies, Australia, Japan, England)
Stephen Jones
1. Clive Woodward (England, Lions)
1. Warren Gatland (Wales, Lions)
3. Ian McGeechan (Scotland, Lions)
4. Mark McCall (Saracens, England)
5. Steve Hansen (All Blacks)
6. Bob Dwyer (Wallabies)
7. Jack Rowell (England)
8. Fred Allen (All Blacks)
9. Carwyn James (Llanelli, Lions)
10. Rassie Erasmus (Springboks)
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Tomp – craigsman’s top five.
1. Andy Robinson
2. Michael Cheika
3. Steve Tandy
4. Nick Easter
5. Geordan Murphy.
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I threw in no3 to see if I could get yos to come back.
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‘Every player in Scotland earning more than £50,000 will be asked to take a salary cut of 10-25% until September, while Scottish Rugby chief executive Mark Dodson will take a 30% reduction.’
70% of a shitload is still quite a lot.
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No room for Bernard Jackman in those lists?
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Brydon Stephens, PE teacher at Dunbar.
Best rugby coach ever
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Don’t know if folk will be able to see this, but I want to be Andrea Pirlo.
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top 5 rugby coaches:
1. Phil Larder
2. Dave Reddin
3. Brian Ashton
4. Dave Alred
5. Andy Robinson
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In fact, Mrs BB says that, apart from the hair, the beard, the sunglasses, the fashion sense, the footballing talent and the fact that he’s Italian (and just generally cool as), I am JUST like Andrea Pirlo…
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That’s some luscious hair
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Top 1 rugby coach:
Mike Ford
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Chimpie – if I was on £55k I’d ask to be on £49,999.99 furra few months. Take the rest as chuppa chup lollies and cola bottle sweets.
But I can’t cos I’m starting work as a consultant at sarries.
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@tomp
you’re forgetting the rest of the Ford coaching empire:
1. Mike Ford
2. Joe Ford – https://www.drfc.co.uk/former-tiger-ford-to-join-coaching-staff/
3. Jacob Ford – https://www.echo-news.co.uk/sport/17822004.ford-named-new-head-coach-westcliff/
George is nowhere to be seen.
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Jacob’s done well at Wesciliff. They stayed up in their highly competitive league this year.
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I think most Bok fans would put Kitch Christie above Rassie. 100% coaching record, albeit only 14 matches in charge, including the ’95 World Cup. Nick Mallett would come close too, with 17 wins on the trot and some glorious rugby played in that time. Overall record wobbled a bit towards the end, but still a fine coach. Italy brain fart notwithstanding.
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Craven as well I think, though he was “manager”. Maybe even Oubaas Markotter.
Rod MacQueen is an amazing miss from both lists as well.
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My favourite Bok coaches have been Allister Coetzee, Rudi Straueli and Harry Viljoen.
You could spring in Izak van Heerden, Ian McIntosh and Skonk Nicholson from SA as good coaches.
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Kitch Christie is a good shout, Deebee. He had the brilliant idea of moving Andrews to Number 8 and signing up Suzie.
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Exeter un-appropriating………………
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/apr/14/exeter-to-repatriate-blackfoot-regalia-to-siksika-nation
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As Dunbar school player you are at the bottom for East Lothian selection, when you play in the trial you play in the “Possibles” v the “Probables” There are five schools in East Lothian, and Dunbar do not get a chance, you have to show that you are better than the guy already picked in your position for East Lothian team, ie you have to oust the guy from the favoured school.
Once you’ve done that you have to do the same thing for the first South of Scotland trial, you get to the final SoS Schools trial after that, when you again have to oust a previously selected guy who is from Hawick or Melrose.
Then you play inter district schools rugby, the South always won, but that was never reflected in the Scottish Schools selection, the state school kids, having beaten their counterparts had to oust the private school kids in a trial.
The number of Scottish schools internationals and South of Scotland Schools representatives Brydon Stephens manged to get into teams every single year, there were always three or more, that singles him out as a great rugby coach, no money, tiny school, just taking boys at age ten or eleven who had never played the game before and making them better than others who had all the breaks going for them and getting them into representative teams, along with some year teams going year on year without losing, including fixtures against the big private schools, that is a great coach.
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Anyway
Among talk of the economy shrinking by 30% etc, just remember something, we had a bit of a run 100 years ago, there was the Boer War, WW1, Spanish Flu, The Great Depression, WW2. After that, the UK built the NHS and the Welfare State, and we paid back debt to the USA at the same time. That was a political choice. A similar choice will be available to us after this. When the applause on Thursdays stops and we come out blinking in the sunlight, we need to remember who the essential workers are, and what the opposition to REAL progress is.
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He sounds like a top coach, ticht. At some point, though, if he’s producing good players consistently it’s going to work in his schoolboys’ favour.
Our school coaches were terrible. It wasn’t a rugby school in my days but has produced some good players since. The head of PE in my first 3 years was a really good bloke and a good teacher but a soccer man. The guy who took over was a rugby player. He pulled fixtures against private schools because they insisted we played at their schools with their refs and all that went with that. No one ever got sent to trials.
Many of us played school rugby on Wednesday and then club youth rugby on Saturday. The first team hooker didn’t get sent to schools trials but played for the Southwest of England Under 19s for two years, a whole bunch of guys in the year above me played under 19 County colts a year out of school. I did the same and it was interesting to find out from other players in that team just how rigged the schools reps sides were. The only state school that had a chance was a school in Salisbury called Bishops Wordsworth that produced both Richard Hills, Dave Egerton and others. Our under 19s county squad was private school free, but those lads often went a different route, big clubs or university. I did play with some private schoolers in the London club Under 19 and Under 21 sides I turned out for. They were mostly good eggs.
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Two more schools coaches from South Africa that are famed.
First, Basil Bey from Bishops in Cape Town, one of the poshest schools in SA. He died a few years ago and the school’s rugby magazine (!) published some marvellous tributes to him. My favourite is the ex-coach of Paul Roos telling the story about Bey getting him to read Ferlinghetti. It’s all here from pages 4 to 11 (and pages 12 to 15 are really about him as well). https://www.bishops.org.za/Platinumblue/2017/plat_blue2017.pdf
The other guy is from Port Elizabeth, a guy called Theo Pieterse. He’s really interesting.
https://www.grassrootsrugby.co.za/man-behind-ithembelihle-high-school-rugby-team-success-theo-pieterse/
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I was more than a bit pissed when I posted that last night – every night is Friday night now.
Tom, it turns out that most schools rugby is rigged, or from what I can gather it seems to be that way. The ironing was huge when, just after I left, one of the schools who were heavily favoured in East Lothian selection left the South of Scotland and threw in with Edinburgh Schools because of bias in the Borders’ selection policy. I did have a wry laugh at that.
Their PE teacher was the one I may have mentioned previously, he gave a penalty against my mate’s mum for shouting from the touchline.
As a young PE teacher he told the then schoolboy Colin Deans to give up rugby as he was rubbish.
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ticht, I was thinking about my rugby at school earlier.
Year 7 – no school team, about 3 classes in PE lessons. Got told off for doing a spin pass as this wasn’t taught “until Year 9”. I played soccer. We had two teams.
Year 8 – some idea there might be a team. Teacher in charge notorious in the school for more interested in boys’ showering technique than their rugby. I went to 1 training session, which was hopeless. I played soccer. We had two teams.
Year 9 – teachers’ strike no sport.
Year 10 – more rugby. Not enough take up in my year so those interested played for the school group up or down. I normally played down because I was a little fella. I played a little soccer but was losing interest. Rugby coaching very limited.
Year 11 – same as year 10.
Year 12/13 – first XV, only 20 or so players in the 2 years interested enough to be in the squads. My first year we had a grand team, lost once in 12 games. My second year we weren’t very good. Coaching was awful in the first year but we played club rugby together and had players who were keen students of the game. Second year was really not good. Teacher in charge could have said that he was “empowering the students by giving them ownership of the team”, but that would have been bollocks.
There were a couple of teachers who were reputed to have been good players. One PE guy was from St Lukes, Exeter, which was one of the key student rugby clubs in the 1960s and 1970s. The story a friend of mine’s dad used to tell was that when he moved to Bournemouth in the 1970s he went to the local club and got picked in the 3rds. He was clearly a good player and so the captain of the 3rds didn’t want to lose him up the club. The teacher got pissed off and packed it in after a couple of months. He never coached a school side regularly.
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Interesting reads there Tom.
I wish Scotland took rugby seriously like SA do. It’s a tricky thing, our PE teacher as mentioned was a good rugby coach but if you didn’t like rugby he wasn’t interested in you. The football guys had the local Belhaven Boys Club which ran sides up through the age groups and the school had hockey teams which were the sole outlet for girls’ sport.
Having said that though, the teachers who had a specific interest ran table tennis, badminton and fencing clubs on their own time.
There was a school golf team, too, but there was no coaching at school, that took place at the two clubs we have in the town.
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More for you, ticht. South African schools rugby is very good but unbelievably argumentative. The Craven Week selections are the biggest bugbears from what I can gather. But even the selections for the selections.
That Newlands rugby day you and I watched last month is good for this. Paarl is home to Paarl Gim and Paarl Boys, two of the strongest rugby schools in SA, consistently top 10 every year, usually top 5. And Boland Landbou, the farming college, is just outside Paarl. So, when they play rep cricket or athletics kids from that school represent Boland, but in rugby they represent Western Province. Kids from other schools in the town represent Boland. The big Paarl schools got turned to Boland for one year in 2001 but then the decision was reversed.
More on it here: https://www.sarugbymag.co.za/why-do-bolands-best-play-for-wp/
https://www.sarugbymag.co.za/why-do-bolands-best-play-for-wp/
Then there’re the other provinces where schools rep sides are stacked with players from the coach’s school.
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Ah, the other link: https://www.iol.co.za/capeargus/sport/province-schools-rugby-to-lose-top-players-492581
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Delightful, informative ATL Trisk, thank you very much. I hope when it gets going again many more kids regularly get to play in games.
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Must stop looking at the Telegraph. Must stop looking at the Telegraph. OK, just one article, food and drink should be ok.
Ah, for God’s fucking sake.
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I am not slurping Boris Broth under any circumstances.
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Be glad they didn’t call it Boris Breath
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Iks! Glad to see you’re still with us. How’s the situation over in Heidelberg?
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The curry house that sponsors our local cricket club delivered 350 meals for the medical staff at the local hospital. Better than Boris Broth
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More a Boris Piping Hot Yoghurt man, chimpie?
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err, no?
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I’m wondering whether to take a trumpian approach to work. If I totally arse something up I’ll just start blaming everyone else with even vague involvement very loudly. Flaw in this plan is that I’m too lazy to keep up the constant noise required.
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Jono Lance to Embra from Wuss is the rumour.
If so it probably means Hickey is offski, he was costing the club a hefty wedge without much of a return, van der Walt has been the better player these last two seasons
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Chimpie, you also have to abuse anyone who asks you about what you’ve been doing, call them nasty and useless, accuse them of fakery, just for asking the question
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Sounds tiring. Maybe if I stop doing any actual work I could manage it.
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Weir > Hickey
Also VDW.
No idea or opinion on Lance, don’t think I’ve ever seen him play.
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Journeyman. Quite good but not as steady as vd Walt. Hope you’re not splashing out too much cash on him. Should’ve made a biggish bid for Chameberlain.
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Thought I’d look in on Scottish football to see what problems other sports are having at the moment. Jesus wept.
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TomP – no matter how bad Dodson is, he is a shining light compared to the idiots that run Scottish football. Not that a lot of the people who actually run the clubs do themselves any favours either.
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Neil Doncaster is a talent, that’s for sure.
And the rest are bad, but in different ways.
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OK what have those fitba eejits been up to?
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